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bop_radarThis week in our vidding chats I want to start talking about different narrative styles in vids. There's a lot of meta out there already on this subject, and many experienced vidders or vid-watchers may have discussed this and thought about it for a lot longer than I have. But this post is where I ask everyone--whether a vidder or vid-watcher--to share with me your thoughts on the following subjects:
- What different types of vid are there?
- What characterises these different types? How do they vary in their structure?
- (As a vidder) are you mainly concerned with telling a story? with making an argument? or with capturing a mood?
- (As a watcher) do you prefer a particular narrative style in the vids you like (e.g. linear story)? /do you have a preferred genre of vid (e.g. humour)?
Disclaimer: a lot of this discussion is about defining different terms and that has disadvantages along with advantages. While it can make it easier to discuss things if we have a shared understanding of certain terms, there are many vids that defy easy classification--and that's absolutely FINE. I hope that this discussion will prove interesting; it is not my intention to limit the ways in which we make and view vids, and everything I say here can be contradicted.
Genres
Before we get to narrative style, I thought we should first think about the different genres of vid. Here are some that spring to mind for me:
- Character studies: focus on a character or characters
- Shipper vids: focus on a relationship
- Comedy: for the giggles!
- AU or constructed reality: the vidder departs from canon and builds their own story from the source
- Action: Vids that foreground action
- Multifandom: Vids that use source from several different sources/fandoms
- What![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
sockkpuppett calls universe vids (vids that show the universe of a show). The term 'recruiter vid' is often used to describe these--they showcase a certain fandom to those who may not be familiar with it.
What other genres can you think of?
Narrative
As a beginner vidder who had watched vids for some time, I was aware of the difference between a (canonically) chronological vid (simply put: clips appear in the order they appear in canon) and a non-chronological one (clips jump around in the canoncial timeline). That was about as subtle as my understanding of narrative in vids got. My very first vid took a chronological approach--it basically recounted one story arc from canon with very few 'diversions' along the way. I was self-conscious that it was 'unsophisticated' because it seemed like the simplest form of narrative. However, I am still drawn to vidding that way and I have made my peace with it.
However, my understanding of different types of vid narrative has deepened, and now I tend to think in terms of the following:
1. Linear narrative
These vids 'tell a story'. There is a beginning, a middle and an end. They can either tell the same story as in canon, or they can tell a different story.
2. Non-linear narrative
There are many forms of non-linear storytelling. One of the simplest examples is a vid that features 'flashbacks' in certain sections. A more complex non-linear narrative may be one that at first appears chaotic, if associative, but which gradually builds up a complex picture of a certain show, character or situation.
3. Persuasive or argument vids
These vids have a central 'argument' that the vidder is making. They may use clips selectively to make or pointedly to make that point. These may be 'meta' vids since they don't just tell a story, they make a point.
4. Vids that 'tell deeper'
This is a term that I thinklaurashapiro first coined. She defines it as follows: 'As a vidder, my interest lies in retelling canonical stories with different emphases, exploring events or feelings that might have gotten glossed over in the show, or characters that received short shrift. I think of this as "telling deeper." And again, that's all about subtext: picking a clip not because of what it literally shows, but because of the emotional information it carries -- which can be due to context, movement, facial expression, or even something as deceptively shallow as color.'
(Personal note: I love telling deeper in my vids!)
5. Freeform/associative vids and mood vids
These are kind of stream-of-consciousness vids--I do think they exist. They may build connections between things, there may be a bit of a story or an argument, but mainly they flow along seamlessly and create an overall impression. In some ways I think humour vids often fall into this category since they're main intention is to capture a certain comedic tone, rather than make an argument or tell a story.
Complicating things further, these categories are not mutually exclusive: you could have a non-linear persuasive vid that is also highly associative, for instance.
Each of these different types of narrative, like each different genre, have their own characteristics. For beginners, maybe the easiest way to think of them is as different ways of organising the clips within your vid.
Related meta
There's a lot of great meta out there on this subject, which you may be interested in if you want to read up on how other vidders think of these things. Here are some related posts, but feel free to share your own:
-heresluck asks what types of vid are there?
-heresluck discusses vids as storytelling.
-heresluck talks about narrative.
-yourlibrarian talks about vid categories.
Discuss!
Now the fun bit! Talk to me! Tell me about the vids you watch and the vids you make. Here are some extra questions to add to the introductory ones above (and to encourage you to talk as much as you want! :p)
- When watching a vid do you ever get confused about the intention of the vidder? do you lose track of the story or argument? What helps you NOT to lose track of the story? What keeps the narrative clear?
- When you think about different categories of vid, what are the main types you think of? (Feel free to give examples of different types--I was going to do so but ran out of time. *g*)
- Vidders: what narrative styles do you use? Do you think about narrative when you vid? Does it help you organise your vid?
- Does it even matter at all? :) Does my post make sense? (Ask questions/quibble with it, if you wish!)
- If we were to discuss a particular genre or narrative style one week in these chats, which would you be most interested in discussing? *ulterior motive*
- What different types of vid are there?
- What characterises these different types? How do they vary in their structure?
- (As a vidder) are you mainly concerned with telling a story? with making an argument? or with capturing a mood?
- (As a watcher) do you prefer a particular narrative style in the vids you like (e.g. linear story)? /do you have a preferred genre of vid (e.g. humour)?
Disclaimer: a lot of this discussion is about defining different terms and that has disadvantages along with advantages. While it can make it easier to discuss things if we have a shared understanding of certain terms, there are many vids that defy easy classification--and that's absolutely FINE. I hope that this discussion will prove interesting; it is not my intention to limit the ways in which we make and view vids, and everything I say here can be contradicted.
Genres
Before we get to narrative style, I thought we should first think about the different genres of vid. Here are some that spring to mind for me:
- Character studies: focus on a character or characters
- Shipper vids: focus on a relationship
- Comedy: for the giggles!
- AU or constructed reality: the vidder departs from canon and builds their own story from the source
- Action: Vids that foreground action
- Multifandom: Vids that use source from several different sources/fandoms
- What
sockkpuppett calls universe vids (vids that show the universe of a show). The term 'recruiter vid' is often used to describe these--they showcase a certain fandom to those who may not be familiar with it.What other genres can you think of?
Narrative
As a beginner vidder who had watched vids for some time, I was aware of the difference between a (canonically) chronological vid (simply put: clips appear in the order they appear in canon) and a non-chronological one (clips jump around in the canoncial timeline). That was about as subtle as my understanding of narrative in vids got. My very first vid took a chronological approach--it basically recounted one story arc from canon with very few 'diversions' along the way. I was self-conscious that it was 'unsophisticated' because it seemed like the simplest form of narrative. However, I am still drawn to vidding that way and I have made my peace with it.
However, my understanding of different types of vid narrative has deepened, and now I tend to think in terms of the following:
1. Linear narrative
These vids 'tell a story'. There is a beginning, a middle and an end. They can either tell the same story as in canon, or they can tell a different story.
2. Non-linear narrative
There are many forms of non-linear storytelling. One of the simplest examples is a vid that features 'flashbacks' in certain sections. A more complex non-linear narrative may be one that at first appears chaotic, if associative, but which gradually builds up a complex picture of a certain show, character or situation.
3. Persuasive or argument vids
These vids have a central 'argument' that the vidder is making. They may use clips selectively to make or pointedly to make that point. These may be 'meta' vids since they don't just tell a story, they make a point.
4. Vids that 'tell deeper'
This is a term that I think
laurashapiro first coined. She defines it as follows: 'As a vidder, my interest lies in retelling canonical stories with different emphases, exploring events or feelings that might have gotten glossed over in the show, or characters that received short shrift. I think of this as "telling deeper." And again, that's all about subtext: picking a clip not because of what it literally shows, but because of the emotional information it carries -- which can be due to context, movement, facial expression, or even something as deceptively shallow as color.'(Personal note: I love telling deeper in my vids!)
5. Freeform/associative vids and mood vids
These are kind of stream-of-consciousness vids--I do think they exist. They may build connections between things, there may be a bit of a story or an argument, but mainly they flow along seamlessly and create an overall impression. In some ways I think humour vids often fall into this category since they're main intention is to capture a certain comedic tone, rather than make an argument or tell a story.
Complicating things further, these categories are not mutually exclusive: you could have a non-linear persuasive vid that is also highly associative, for instance.
Each of these different types of narrative, like each different genre, have their own characteristics. For beginners, maybe the easiest way to think of them is as different ways of organising the clips within your vid.
Related meta
There's a lot of great meta out there on this subject, which you may be interested in if you want to read up on how other vidders think of these things. Here are some related posts, but feel free to share your own:
-
heresluck asks what types of vid are there?-
heresluck discusses vids as storytelling.-
heresluck talks about narrative.-
yourlibrarian talks about vid categories.Discuss!
Now the fun bit! Talk to me! Tell me about the vids you watch and the vids you make. Here are some extra questions to add to the introductory ones above (and to encourage you to talk as much as you want! :p)
- When watching a vid do you ever get confused about the intention of the vidder? do you lose track of the story or argument? What helps you NOT to lose track of the story? What keeps the narrative clear?
- When you think about different categories of vid, what are the main types you think of? (Feel free to give examples of different types--I was going to do so but ran out of time. *g*)
- Vidders: what narrative styles do you use? Do you think about narrative when you vid? Does it help you organise your vid?
- Does it even matter at all? :) Does my post make sense? (Ask questions/quibble with it, if you wish!)
- If we were to discuss a particular genre or narrative style one week in these chats, which would you be most interested in discussing? *ulterior motive*
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no subject
Date: 2008-10-11 11:18 pm (UTC)Excellent! I'm glad you've raised viewer expectation and intention as well as vidder intention. Great point. We can't control how others will view our vids.
We could probably choose a vid and ask everyone to define what category it would primarily fall into and what narrative style it uses and I bet we’d get lots of different answers for lots of different reasons (which would, um, be really interesting now that I think about it :D).
Hee! Yes, very true.
meta, but that's just my catch-all category
I use that too, yes.
I always like to think I’m trying to do is “tell deeper,”
*nods* You probably saw above that
I loved your ramble and am totally glad that you felt happy responding this way. My questions in these chats are only ever there as initial prompts for anyone who wants to use them. I'm happy to hear anything even remotely on topic. ;)
no subject
Date: 2008-10-12 05:41 pm (UTC)Which is often kind of cool, like you said above, it's pretty awesome to make something that can kind of take on a life of its own, that others can map their own interpretations and thoughts onto. The biggest compliment in my eyes about my first vid was someone telling me it was disturbing and someone else telling me it was hopeful. Totally opposing interpretations! Sweet! But, also, I can't categorize that vid at all; interpretation is wide open, and even I could see conflicting interpretations of my own vid throughout the process of making it.
But the opposite situation, when I can categorize a vid, can feel very restrictive and makes me not want to put it into a category (even when it clearly belongs there!). Because I've really been thinking lately about how to combat certain expectations that I know will greet a vid I have in mind. I've had a specific Adama/Roslin vid bunny in my head for months, so I'm pretty sure I've got to make it. But even calling it that, "an Adama/Roslin vid," brings up all sorts of preconceptions and associations that I violently do not want. This goes to genre as well (topic!); do I have to call it a shipper vid? To me, that brings all sorts of baggage with it, so calling it that makes me cringe for my poor little (imaginary) vid. But yet, that's sort of what it is, insofar as it's obviously about their partnership/relationship. Putting it into that category doesn't feel restrictive to me, because I know what I mean when I say it's A/R shippy, but that is SO different from what I know others mean when they say the same thing. I'm going to make the resolutely non-romantic vid that's in my head either way, but I feel like defining it one way or the other restricts my ability to get that vision across to other people, who are inevitably going to start with a notion of what a shipper vid, and in particular an A/R shipper vid, is "saying" (if that doesn't turn them off from watching it at all). So I almost feel like I have to overcome that first, somehow, before I can even tell my own story. And of course, as a viewer, I'm guilty of doing this too. I can't say how many times I've not watched a vid that's labeled "A/R shipper vid," or "Baltar character study," or whatever, because I have preconceptions of what that vid will be about. Obviously this problem exists with defining and categorizing everything, but definitions and categories are necessary, so there's really nothing to do but ramble about it.
Um yeah, you want to be careful of encouraging faintly on topic rambles from me. Just saying. :)
no subject
Date: 2008-10-12 08:39 pm (UTC)Putting it into that category doesn't feel restrictive to me, because I know what I mean when I say it's A/R shippy, but that is SO different from what I know others mean when they say the same thing
*nods* Yeah... I see what you mean. If I were you I'd probably avoid referring to it as a shipper vid because most people will expect it to be heavily romantic if you call it that. Maybe don't call it anything? I mean, you could just say 'Characters: Adama and Roslin' and 'Notes: explores their partnership'. By avoiding the term 'A/R ship' you signal pretty clearly that it's not a traditional shipper vid, I think?
I've seen with vids of an unlikely kind (e.g. a great take on an unpopular character) that word of mouth does a lot... i.e. if people rec your vid then people will watch on the strength of the rec regardless of genre. I've watched some damn unlikely genres I would never otherwise watch on the strength of recs. ;) Of course having the goal 'get recced' when you are vidding is not helpful at ALL, so ignore that last bit and just make it, I say. ;)
no subject
Date: 2008-10-12 10:05 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-10-13 02:38 am (UTC)I think character vids are more commonly taken seriously than shipper vids, but I agree about shipper vids. I feel there's a certain stigma attached to them and I do not like it. ;) I kind of don't care because I'm a rebel like that and I think there are some shipper vids out there that beat the pants off any other vids... and I'll continue to think that regardless of whether they get the critical acclaim they deserve, but I do know what you mean. I think anything shippy has a bit of a stigma attached to it, actually... which I find sort of silly. I mean why be snobbish about people having a passion for a certain ship, when passion of some sort is surely the one thing that drew us all to fandom in the first place?
I think sometimes the subtextual or implied argument is that if you are a shipper you can't see things objectively. I take issue with that, because I think the subjectivity of one's view of canon exists regardless of who you ship or what character you like. Ususally I find that people who are snobby about those things just mean that they don't like whatever it is that they're talking about--which is a different thing entirely.
/ramble